Chariot Archers

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Yes another whine about Egypt unit thread.

Why do Chariots Archers have:
A) Long Range
B) High HP
C) Fast Movement Speed
D) High DPS

They can just hit and run all day long and there are NO Greek units that can counter this whatsoever. Peltast range is shorter than Chariot Range (which makes no sense to me) so they can hit and run them.

Greek counter archer units are: Sari and Peltast - both of which get owned and hit and run by Chariot Archers...So what exactly can Greek do vs them?

This problem is GREATLY enhanced by the fact they can get +30% range with advisors + gear

|||If someone knows a counter please tell me.|||

trust me, they were worse (Way faster and longer ranged) during the beta, before a bunch of stuff and advisors were nerfed. thyre pretty good now

hippokins are very good at countering them, but if they cant catch up, then focus on getting his eco. chariots cant kill hippokins fast enough. when they where 2 pop it was pretty easy. ballistaes andpreistsalso do a great job. id suggest masssarri's though, they do great despite what some people say, espicially for thier price

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They are not pretty good now....they are OP (in my opinion).

Dude you can't tell me a counter to chariot archers is an Age 4 unit (hippikon + balista)...Thats kinda pointless.

Sari still get hit and run...

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i'd be surprised if chariot archers can hit and run saris. saris are probably the fastest units in the game except maybe for the scout. however if the chariot archer is as fast or faster than saris, then that sounds like a problem and should be changed.

i don't play egyptians (there is NO way i am grinding my way back up to pvpable levels to play with them) but im pretty sure they are around double of the cost of toxotes and come in later (age 3 instead of 2). saris can be built in age 2 so it's not like you have to be in age 3 to counter them.

also hit and running is a micro intensive and skilful tactic, and should be rewarded imo. anybody can get a bunch of spearmen or thatever to attack move into the enemy, but it takes good timing and tactics as well as a lot of unit babysitting to hit and run effectively. most egyptians i've played against just use chariot archers like big toxys, completely ignoring their guerilla potential.

|||Sari's are about the same speed as Chariot Archers (maybe a tiny bit faster I think?), but Chariot archers are able to hit and run them because they aren't ranged units (I wouldn't call their attack "ranged") and so completely out range them. And every Sari will die in one hit no matter what because CA have silly DPS.

Hit and running is a good skill (although not as hard as you make it seem). But just because someone can micro their archers to hit and run it does not mean they should be untouchable and should still destory their direct counters (Peltast with +32% max range, Sari).|||

100% agree, chariots OP. We really need to nerf this civ :S:S.

|||Can't help but know I probably sound like a whiner, but I seriously am 100% that Chariot Archers are OP atm. Still lots of credit to good Egyptian players, it takes skill to micro them! But I really dont think counter-archer units should get owned by archer units....|||

try to build FORT and boom

also 3 peltas = 1 chariot.

|||Problem is a lot of the time I get hit and run by Chariots there is no way I can get a fortress down in time as I can barely keep up unit production to replace all my units getting hit and run by the Chariots Archers.

Also what happens when I need to expand and take my next gold?

Also 20 chariot archers > 60 Peltast because they can hit and run and barely get hit. As my army of Peltast shrinks your army of Chariot Archers grows.

Also why do Chariot Archers get to equal Peltast in attack/hp but get to out-range AND! out-speed them?|||You have to remember, 1 chariot archer is equivalent to 3 toxotes. That's why the hp and dps is so high.
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Because neither Microsoft or GPG have made truly competitive RTS before.

I'm liking this game a lot, but some balance issues here makes me appreciate Blizzard on SC2 that much more.

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More importantly...that doesnt explain why they are insanely faster AND have better range than Peltast (an apparent direct age 3 counter to archers). So 1 chariot archer doesn't actually = 3 peltast/toxtoi. 1 chariot archer = 3 peltast/toxtoi on cocaine.

And the whole "1 chariot archer = 3 peltast/toxtoi" and "1 ele = 4/5 hoplites" isn't the best analogy. A half hp Chariot archer deals full damage, a "half hp" group of 3 toxtoi/peltast deals 1/3rd or 2/3rd damage. Having one unit as strong as three units (stats-wise) actually makes it stronger then them as they put into just one unit. Egypt get mobility advantage in age 2 with camels...why do they also get mobility advantage with chariot archers in age 3 :S ?

The argument isn't that a Chariot archer does or doesn't = 3 peltast or 3 toxtoi.....it's that they are OP because they are good at EVERYTHING and own everything and can hit and run everything. Their direct counter, a Peltast, should not get owned by them....That doesn't seem a bit off to you?

Maybe buffing Peltast range to the same (or further, to make up for speed loss) of chariots is what is needed? Either way I want to be able to counter Chariot Archers with my anti-archers - not get hit and run and actually lose to them.

Edit: Lol and just found out there is -15% cost star tech for them

|||yesterday i fought a pvp battle against a level 37 who was pllaying as egypt.in the mid-game battles (age 3) i just could not take out his chariot archers.so i rushed to age 4(i sacrifised all my economy ,so i really hoped gastraphetes would work) and made gastraphetess(they do not really counter chariot archers but they made a pretty good job) to take out the chariot archers while my hoplites were taking all the damage.of course he tried to retreat.and this is when my prodromos come to play.i used my prodromos to make a flanking manouver and eventually he could not leave.so he lost.although gastraphetes will do the job in my opinion chariot archers should be nerfed(like you said)cause there is no unit that can really counter them.
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Yea you shouldn't have to age 4 to counter age 3 unit.

Anyone who doesn't think Chariot Archers are OP are most-likely kidding themselves or haven't had enough experience with/against them.